+- Dinkleberg's GMod (https://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/site)
+-- Forum: Trouble in Terrorist Town (https://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/site/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: TTT Appeals (https://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/site/forumdisplay.php?fid=9)
+---- Forum: TTT Appeals Archive (https://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/site/forumdisplay.php?fid=47)
+---- Thread: muddy ban appeal (/showthread.php?tid=20014)
muddy ban appeal - grasse - 01-02-2025
Ingame Name: grasse
SteamID: STEAM_0:1:95996204
Who Banned You: tiefling
Reason For Ban: warn threshold
Length of Ban: perma
Reason for Admins to Unban: i've changed a lot in this past year, and seeing so many i thought worse off than me being unbanned, i felt i should try as well. i rarely play this game anymore and i doubt being unbanned will change that but at least i'd be given the option to turn my brain off for an hour or two again. haven't alted since my last ban and i guarantee it will b the last ban on my 17 streak
Have you been banned before (Link relevant threads): yes
Other: happy new year
RE: muddy ban appeal - chibill - 01-02-2025
(01-02-2025, 09:08 PM)grasse Wrote: Ingame Name: grasse
SteamID: STEAM_0:1:95996204
Who Banned You: tiefling
Reason For Ban: warn threshold
Length of Ban: perma
Reason for Admins to Unban: i've changed a lot in this past year, and seeing so many i thought worse off than me being unbanned, i felt i should try as well. i rarely play this game anymore and i doubt being unbanned will change that but at least i'd be given the option to turn my brain off for an hour or two again. haven't alted since my last ban and i guarantee it will b the last ban on my 17 streak
Have you been banned before (Link relevant threads): yes
Other: happy new year
Hi Grasse, I can confirm you have not ban evaded since your last ban evasion back in Feb of 2024.
I will however post the list of your 15 known alts for completeness.
RE: muddy ban appeal - Nate - 01-03-2025
hi grasse
RE: muddy ban appeal - Rox5tar01 - 01-03-2025
NOTE: SOME INFO MAY BE INCORRECT. VIEW CHIBILLS POST AFTER FOR CORRECTIONS
I'm gonna start this off by saying that I don't know you personally. From what I've seen, you've been involved in the Stinkleburg community since about early 2020. I also recall seeing you on the Muddy ban as a helpful hand in figuring out if they were actually scripting/cheating or not. Still though, I'm going to be speaking from a more logical standpoint on how I feel.
According to the Global Ban page, you've had a total of 18 bans, for the reasons including but not limited too:
Repeated RDM
RDM and Leave x2
Slurs x4
Grapple Exploiting x3
Alt Evasion x2
Multiple Warn Thresholds (one of which was registered to the name "kill the gays.....")
B-Hop Scripting
In addition, while I'm not gonna pull up every single of the alts in that list, you've also been stated by admins of having a multitude of warns on at least a few of those alts, with reasons including but not limited to RDM and Slurs (referencing some accusations from Tiefling in a previous appeal). Again, not gonna go try and dig up every single thing for those alts, I'll leave that to the staff.
Also... 15 alts?! Seriously? That's CRAZY. I'm also willing to bet that if someone is willing to make 15 alts to ban evade, that probably isn't all of them. You can deny it if you want, and I obviously don't have any proof of that and as such shouldn't factor into whether you get unbanned or not. I'm moreso just trying to emphasize how ridiculous 15 cases of ban evasion (and at least one discord ban evasion) are, and it's not too outlandish to assume that you haven't done it any more than that. However, we can go off of what Chibill says and say that you have not evaded since Feb 2024.
SO. You've been banned numerous times for some pretty big issues and caught ban evading many times. Still though, everyone is able to file for an appeal. However, the only points you've made in your appeal are:
"i've changed a lot in this past year"
How? In what way? Did you change for better or worse? Everybody changes in their lifetime, but just acknowledging that you've changed doesn't tell us anything.
and
"seeing so many i thought worse off than me being unbanned, i felt i should try as well"
Fun fact, this type of argument is called an Ad Verecundiam, or Argument from Authority. It basically means that a person of authority has a certain opinion in a separate case, so you try to apply that opinion to this completely separate situation. In this case it's "the admins have unbanned so many no no peeps, so I should be as well"). This is NOT a good way to argue your point, and is actually a very popular fallacy in debate (I did competitive debate in HS, so being able to nerd out about something like this for the first time in many years is nice). Also, is comparing yourself to people you think are worse off really the play here?
SO.
In short your reasons stated for being appealed are acknowledging the fact that people change (but not stating how, or whether for better or worse), and using a very common argument fallacy. In fact, you haven't really mentioned any of the reasons you've been banned; you just kinda acknowledged that you did indeed ban evade and that the other bans exist (except not even that because you just acknowledged the number of bans and not specific bans themselves, OF WHICH THE NUMBER WASN'T EVEN CORRECT. There are 18, not 17). There doesn't seem to even be a hint of remorse, to me it just seems like you are appealing for the sake of appealing. The problem is that at least to me, this isn't a case of "Jose.Gonzales.2007" the guest appealing a mass RDM ban. This is a repeated case of bans and un-bans over the span of multiple years for (what I consider to be) much more serious actions (Evading, Slurs, Exploitation/Cheating). In case it's not obvious, I'm a -1 on this. Given the time though, I'd be willing to change to a 0 or even a +1 if you could make a bit better of an appeal (79 words ain't gonna cut it here slick). Otherwise, this really just seems like a lazy appeal on top of an already egregious history.
TLDR: No.
RE: muddy ban appeal - chibill - 01-03-2025
(01-03-2025, 01:45 AM)Rox5tar01 Wrote: SO.
In short your reasons stated for being appealed are acknowledging the fact that people change (but not stating how, or whether for better or worse), and using a very common argument fallacy. In fact, you haven't really mentioned any of the reasons you've been banned; you just kinda acknowledged that you did indeed ban evade and that the other bans exist (except not even that because you just acknowledged the number of bans and not specific bans themselves, OF WHICH THE NUMBER WASN'T EVEN CORRECT. There are 18, not 17). There doesn't seem to even be a hint of remorse, to me it just seems like you are appealing for the sake of appealing. The problem is that at least to me, this isn't a case of "Jose.Gonzales.2007" the guest appealing a mass RDM ban. This is a repeated case of bans and un-bans over the span of multiple years for (what I consider to be) much more serious actions (Evading, Slurs, Exploitation/Cheating). In case it's not obvious, I'm a -1 on this. Given the time though, I'd be willing to change to a 0 or even a +1 if you could make a bit better of an appeal (79 words ain't gonna cut it here slick). Otherwise, this really just seems like a lazy appeal on top of an already egregious history.
Actually he only has 16 total bans, one of them was a "bad ban" where bhop-scripting as included without any evidence of such, so they were unbanned and re-banned, and another was where he was banned for the wrong length and then was unbanned and re-banned with the right time.
Additionally 7 of those bans are from 2020, 4 are from 2022, 5 are from 2023. Additionally 3 of the alts are from before his current perma ban. (One was technically from the perma, but wasn't caught except after the perma, but was already banned before that for ban evasion of a ban on that alt)
Figure I would clear that up. So to be clear he was never banned for B-Hop Scripting, all the RDM banns are well over 4 years old, the Grapple Exploiting aren't really relevant anymore (this was gaining high horizontal speed with the grappling hook), Additionally I don't understand why his ban reason includes 30-point awarn threshold (The old perma ban number) when he only ever hit 24 awarn points. (due to 5 active slur warns over the course of 2 months before the ban.)
So I think I might have some new investigating to do.
RE: muddy ban appeal - Rox5tar01 - 01-03-2025
(01-03-2025, 02:17 AM)chibill Wrote:Alright, I'm glad to see that the information is corrected. I'll add a little disclaimer onto my post. Still though, my points of the multitude of bans (albeit to a slightly lesser extent) as well as the lackluster appeal still stand.(01-03-2025, 01:45 AM)Rox5tar01 Wrote: SO.
In short your reasons stated for being appealed are acknowledging the fact that people change (but not stating how, or whether for better or worse), and using a very common argument fallacy. In fact, you haven't really mentioned any of the reasons you've been banned; you just kinda acknowledged that you did indeed ban evade and that the other bans exist (except not even that because you just acknowledged the number of bans and not specific bans themselves, OF WHICH THE NUMBER WASN'T EVEN CORRECT. There are 18, not 17). There doesn't seem to even be a hint of remorse, to me it just seems like you are appealing for the sake of appealing. The problem is that at least to me, this isn't a case of "Jose.Gonzales.2007" the guest appealing a mass RDM ban. This is a repeated case of bans and un-bans over the span of multiple years for (what I consider to be) much more serious actions (Evading, Slurs, Exploitation/Cheating). In case it's not obvious, I'm a -1 on this. Given the time though, I'd be willing to change to a 0 or even a +1 if you could make a bit better of an appeal (79 words ain't gonna cut it here slick). Otherwise, this really just seems like a lazy appeal on top of an already egregious history.
Actually he only has 16 total bans, one of them was a "bad ban" where bhop-scripting as included without any evidence of such, so they were unbanned and re-banned, and another was where he was banned for the wrong length and then was unbanned and re-banned with the right time.
Additionally 7 of those bans are from 2020, 4 are from 2022, 5 are from 2023. Additionally 3 of the alts are from before his current perma ban. (One was technically from the perma, but wasn't caught except after the perma, but was already banned before that for ban evasion of a ban on that alt)
Figure I would clear that up. So to be clear he was never banned for B-Hop Scripting, all the RDM banns are well over 4 years old, the Grapple Exploiting aren't really relevant anymore (this was gaining high horizontal speed with the grappling hook), Additionally I don't understand why his ban reason includes 30-point awarn threshold (The old perma ban number) when he only ever hit 24 awarn points. (due to 5 active slur warns over the course of 2 months before the ban.)
So I think I might have some new investigating to do.
RE: muddy ban appeal - bunniey - 01-03-2025
(01-03-2025, 01:45 AM)Rox5tar01 Wrote: "the admins have unbanned so many no no peeps, so I should be as well").I don't like how this was said. He said other people who did worse successfully appealed, so he should try as well, not so he should also just be unbanned. Those are vastly different statements, one assuming an outcome, and the other simply saying "Oh, if thing A happened, thing B is also a possibility"
Also, just to nitpick more, acknowledging someone is changing is fine. In an unban appeal, if someone brings up change, it can be assumed to be positive change just given the setting. And, very very very often, if someone talks about "how" they've changed or what steps they have been taking to change in their appeals, people accuse them of trying to play sympathy or manipulate people in other ways to get unbanned, usually that sort of thing is said in private but has been said on posts before as well.
For the actual unban, I'd say unban at the 1 year mark on a short leash. I can attest to some positive changes made, he left the dinklecrew joker group discord server and that is the most positive change anyone can possibly make. RDM stuff is whatever, grapple exploits are whatever, bhop nothing, it's really just the slurs and evasion. A year is fine imo
RE: muddy ban appeal - Dinomoto - 01-03-2025
We can state the ifs, buts and maybes about what someone might have done since their last ban, however as someone not familiar with said person, I'm supportive of an unban. +1
RE: muddy ban appeal - tiefling lesbian - 01-03-2025
(01-03-2025, 02:17 AM)chibill Wrote: Additionally I don't understand why his ban reason includes 30-point awarn threshold (The old perma ban number) when he only ever hit 24 awarn points. (due to 5 active slur warns over the course of 2 months before the ban.)He had 50+ active points across multiple accounts, which has been explained to you multiple times
So I think I might have some new investigating to do.
RE: muddy ban appeal - Ryan - 01-03-2025
(01-03-2025, 02:56 PM)tiefling lesbian Wrote:Yo chill. Chibill isnt the one appealing here. Its likely he just forgot. I didn't see any accusation from him. In fact, he probably assumed there was an explanation, which is why he was going to look into it further.(01-03-2025, 02:17 AM)chibill Wrote: Additionally I don't understand why his ban reason includes 30-point awarn threshold (The old perma ban number) when he only ever hit 24 awarn points. (due to 5 active slur warns over the course of 2 months before the ban.)He had 50+ active points across multiple accounts, which has been explained to you multiple times
So I think I might have some new investigating to do.
Grasse, Im indifferent to you being unbanned, mainly because your last ban evasion happened a couple months after I joined the community and I dont really know you or what you're like. Your extensive history is concerning, but you have gone nearly a year without evading. I think it has been a decent amount of time, and wouldnt be opposed to giving you another shot with or without a probationary period with points.