[lacer]

There's no way to achieve 100% transparency, this is a given and if you think otherwise you are either new or you have a brain without wrinkles. Rand is very obviously not going to tell anybody who shared staff chat not only because he doesn't want that person being punished, but it's not at all related to the issue he's trying to bring up. Also, just because he's the one bringing up this issue does NOT mean he has to (or even can, at this point) do anything about it. im too lazy to type anything else

[Jammin]

Looking for solutions not an argument.

It was suggested possibly adding regular members to a revamped committee system. Perhaps that would be a good way for more staff transparency.

That being said leaking staff chat is not the proper way to get transparency. Sensitive issues are discussed there that shouldn't be released e.g. harassment evidence (including victim names), doxxing evidence, hack evidence, discussion on staff apps, etc.
There's a reason why most news sources won't release names of victims of certain crimes. Similar concept here.

[dero]

Looking for solutions not an argument.

It was suggested possibly adding regular members to a revamped committee system. Perhaps that would be a good way for more staff transparency.

That being said leaking staff chat is not the proper way to get transparency. Sensitive issues are discussed there that shouldn't be released e.g. harassment evidence (including victim names), doxxing evidence, hack evidence, discussion on staff apps, etc.
There's a reason why most news sources won't release names of victims of certain crimes. Similar concept here.

according to the committee thread im still in a few

[[Yellow] Travis1421]

This is how we know Rand touched a nerve, and now staff feels vulnerable. They just want to yell about the leak, and not actually address the post itself.

I fully disagree with this statement actually. The issue was talked about and they were told to drop it and not talk about it in the staff chat. They haven't discussed it since in the chat and they dropped it when they were told to. You were once staff. You know how serious staff leaks are taken. You're just trying to find a problem when the problem was handled and are only backing up your friend.

[jax]

This is gold coming from you considering when I made the community discussion post this is what you said verbatim:

“there isn't an actual disconnect between staff and players, that's something i've heard from certain groups in the playerbase ever since i started coming on and it's just not a thing, even before i was staff, the people just like to spread that around to discredit staffing decisions at every turn, ultimately they're more often than not in the wrong because they're doing whatever thing they know they shouldn't be, and get in trouble for it, waaah

a post just like this is made quarterly, no one has brought in fresh ideas or shone light on a new issue with them, and nothing will get solved, because ultimately some group of people will always have something to complain about, and when that group complains enough, it makes everyone think there's an issue, and then everyone is complaining about a non-issue”

Now you:

“ This begs the question. Why was the community not aware of this issue, and what other issues are the community unaware of that they should probably know?”

“ There is zero transparency, no one knows who voted, how they voted, or why they voted that way on any manner. No one knows who is for or against closure of any threads, it's just decided without warning sometimes, and with warning other times, that it's become too much.”

“ This would erase the constant complaint of a disconnect between the staff team and the playerbase”

[Battons]

I've said it once before I'll say it again, If you have questions or concerns I've made sure anything that is not sensitive information has been relayed to those who have asked. We don't sneak about in the staff discord to spite our players, we basically just shitpost and throw ideas around until stuff sticks. The reason you don't see all of it is most of it is garbage and only a few things which are then shown to you all.

[TheUltraFish]

Wow thanks Forums for fucking up my response.

There is a number things you could have done. You could have filed a report with any of the admins. Me, Dong and Nicol were around on a near daily basis and would not have had this fly. You could have filed a report on the forums and had only shared the evidence with the upper staff until they decided it was alright to be released. Since you were staff at the time, you could have gotten all the "evidence" you collected legitimately and brought it up as a concern instead of messaging a bunch of people (I know of at least 3 that were messaged and that's without mass messaging people) behind everyone's back.

Things like this is why there are things not made public because people in this community would go on witch hunts especially since people in this community like just assuming things, not reading things clearly, getting all angsty about little things, or taking the smallest illegitimate things and making them something ginormous even though they should have never reached that level.

You CHOSE to not do it legitimately and now I question your true motives other than to just start shit since said situation was already handled.

[RussEfarmer]

arguing arguing

To address transparency, I don't like black boxes. That's a big reason I like this community, the userbase can involve themselves in just about every aspect of the server "politics", anything from who gets promoted to moderator, to what guns get nerfed and buffed, to who gets unbanned for what and why. A big reason this happens so freely through the forums is because knowledge regarding the inner workings of the community is very open, which is a big contrast to other communities. We know who runs things like staff applications up the line (or at least we used to), we know who handles bans and unbans, who handles the guns and the map rotation, etc. Someone made a joke that the forums are "gamer congress", and while it's pretty stupid looking in from the outside, I think it's pretty awesome.

aaand then you get to things like committees.. it used to be the admins and active moderators got together in a little pow wow to discuss open staff applications, unban requests, and the like, and depending on what the consensus was, you either denied it or went through with it. When I was admin with Starky, when someone applied with staff, you'd just scoop up a couple of active moderators, or sometimes players, into a steam group chat, discuss some pros and cons, and the decision was done and over.

The committee system is like that, but it's.. kinda weird. The active committee member list hasn't been updated in months. Who's on the committee still? Who's still eligible to be on the committee in the first place? Why can't we see the outcome of the votes? It just sort of.. happens behind a veil. Obviously sensitive information shouldn't be shared, but not being able to see what's going on is frustrating.

Obviously if I was actually a part of the staff team I would have a better understanding, but hey, regular player perspective. I would personally like to see who voted on something from the committee, what their vote was, and why.

[bunniey]

Wow thanks Forums for fucking up my response.

There is a number things you could have done. You could have filed a report with any of the admins. Me, Dong and Nicol were around on a near daily basis and would not have had this fly. You could have filed a report on the forums and had only shared the evidence with the upper staff until they decided it was alright to be released. Since you were staff at the time, you could have gotten all the "evidence" you collected legitimately and brought it up as a concern instead of messaging a bunch of people (I know of at least 3 that were messaged and that's without mass messaging people) behind everyone's back.

Things like this is why there are things not made public because people in this community would go on witch hunts especially since people in this community like just assuming things, not reading things clearly, getting all angsty about little things, or taking the smallest illegitimate things and making them something ginormous even though they should have never reached that level.

You CHOSE to not do it legitimately and now I question your true motives other than to just start shit since said situation was already handled.

Except it was done "legitimately" Fish. I went to admins. I didn't go to you because I wasn't even aware it pertained to PH, that's my bad. Should have checked. But the problem lies in the fact that there wasn't any conversation afterwards. It was one person deciding what to do without even talking. The admins weren't even communicating with each other when they shared a sever they'd been admining. Should I have talked to more than who I did? Yes. That's my bad, as well. I shouldn't have assumed it would just be a single person deciding what happens, but I figured there would be more of a discussion. I apologize for that.

[thunderwalrusinnthebar]

Like what would you like us to be more transparent about? Somethings should not be known by every player. An example of this is if a player is being targeted but doesn't want it to be known that they are being targeted I am not going to share with the entire community who that player is.