[Ckg]

1. Even the person who created this thread didn’t receive backlash after receiving his position on the web staff team through the same process. 

2. Laced shouldn’t be punished for something that has never been this much of an issue before. 

1. This is an extremely flawed argument to make.  Battons did not receive backlash because he was not a controversial addition.  It is a false equivalency to equate the promotion of Laced to the promotion of Battons in the same way it a logical fallacy to say that an admin removing a map from rotation that no one plays anyways should have to same reaction as the same admin removing one of the most played maps.  There is no comparison to be made because they are two completely different instances; one without controversy and one with.  It seems like you are saying that people should be expected to have the same reaction to something they agree with and something they disagree with. It just makes no sense.

2. It is also not a punishment to be put through what most agree should be the standard process for staff.  I think this where your bias is showing.  You equate Laced's promotion being held to the same standard of every other promotion to a punishment, when in reality it just bringing it within the norm and not making it an exception.  With this argument you are saying that Laced deserves to above the normal process and that by bringing him down to level of everyone else that it is a punishment.

[reinaberg]

With this argument you are saying that Laced deserves to above the normal process and that by bringing him down to level of everyone else that it is a punishment.

If it is any consolation; as the person who said it, I can confirm that I did not say that.

[Battons]

I believe she was trying to say that removing a promotion that’s already been given only to have him apply would be unfair which to be honest I agree with.
However where my opinion differs is that he should not be web mod and he should not reapply

[jax]

Its the same group of people with the same mentality with the same rash behaviour.

I have to agree with you there. For the past few months there has been a group of people consistently harassing, berating, and targeting those they don’t like, almost to the point of obsession. It has been especially difficult to handle as staff because that group also tries to render staff powerless to intervene by claiming they’re being censored and discriminated against, and by publicly calling out everything they disagree with using an immeasurable amount of vitriol. 

It’s sometimes frustrating to read their accusations, because they show that they’re fully aware that their actions are inexcusable; they just don’t recognize that they’re describing their own behavior. And so, they continue to freely torment other community members without repercussions, while even going as far as to flame the staff having to punish them for breaking the rules.

I truly hope that this problem is resolved before more staff and server members are successfully bullied into abandoning things they used to enjoy. 

It’s unfortunate that this situation has led to you needing to leave the community for your well-being, but I do hope that this decision relieves you of the stress that the drama has caused.

It's pretty transparent which "group" you're talking about and who you are talking about. So if you're gonna cast such big accusations, you should legitimately back it up.  

Publicly, or within the admin chat, you should be bringing documented proof of these individuals "freely tormenting" other community members and "consistently harassing, berating and targeting those they don't like...with an immeasurable amount of vitrol". Those are some hefty accusations. 

If it exists, which it very well might, as an admin you should be taking care of it with the support of the other staff members. These things are against community rules and should be punished accordingly.

Otherwise this just comes across as baseless accusations about people you disagree with

[happy]

Man if only Dinkleberg was alive

[HONG]

regardless of if you like or hate laced or do or do not think he should be web mod, he still deserves patience as he settles into a new position he’s never had before, same as any other staff member that gets a new role; from there, i trust gabe enough for him to correctly judge how laced performs and help him to improve

this whole thread is unironically a waste of time over something that doesnt matter whatsoever (who cares about web moderation) and it was too late to undo the decision since the second it was made, gabe as a former and current admin is smart enough to be able to see how laced will do and go from there

[Ckg]

1. If it is any consolation; as the person who said it, I can confirm that I did not say that.

2. I have to agree with you there. For the past few months there has been a group of people consistently harassing, berating, and targeting those they don’t like, almost to the point of obsession. It has been especially difficult to handle as staff because that group also tries to render staff powerless to intervene by claiming they’re being censored and discriminated against, and by publicly calling out everything they disagree with using an immeasurable amount of vitriol

1. Fair. apologies for misinterpreting, it just came off that way to me. I would appreciate a response to the other part.

2. I think it is pretty disingenuous to misconstrue Avi's argument to suit your narrative since, as I would hope you know, you are not talking about the same group she is.  In fact, in this whole response you make a lot of big assumptions that do not really hold water.  If consistently disagreeing with the promotion of someone that I think should not have even a modicum of power over the community is deemed harassment and targeting by you, then so be it.  You are free to try and discredit opinions by slapping the label of toxicity on whoever opposes your point of view.  Just as I am free to disagree with Laced being in a position of power, you are free to take the easy way out by deeming disagreement as toxicity and harassment. 

However, this labeling is extremely concerningly, especially from an admin, because seems like you are dog-whistling for a community ban since both toxicity and harassment , as you have described them, are offenses that constitute that punishment.  We have seen harassment in this community before and for you to lower the standard this far due to a differing point of view is, at best, worrying and calls into question your judgement and interpretation of the rules, and, at worst, a thinly-veiled threat to stop opposing the forward progress of someone or face the consequences from those, who hold a position of power, who support said person. Even giving you the benefit of the doubt, those accusations carry a serious weight, especially now that you have the power of an admin, and it was you, and only you, who picked those words knowing the context that they carry.

So my question is, do you think that those who have consistently opposed Laced are now delving into the depths of harassment because they refuse to give in and support his march upward?  Or was your claim of harassment and targeting a hyperbole/oversimplification?

[Foxka]

Bro dong hasn't done anything wrong lmao and stop pointing fingers at vague groups yall think exist that clearly don't. I'm gonna assume this is going to be "dong group vs laced group" and that is so far removed from reality it's disgusting. This isn't a friend group war this is people who have dealt with so so many issues with an individual trying to express discontent of his literal rise to power lmao. The biggest concern I'm seeing arise now is miscontruing things as harassment that had been ignored from the opposing end.

Honestly it's crazy how when the community had been doing so well for itself and was a genuinely fun environment has diluted back down to the toxicity the *moment* these former admins left. It's so obvious it's going unchecked.

I do NOT support laced in any position of staff and I do NOT support this decision to promote him to even such a minor role of web mod.

The saddest thing about this whole thread is absolutely nothing will come from it and it's just gonna get worse and worse lmfao. Here's some food for thought, maybe look into the mirror when people you don't like are suddenly giving backlash to you. Like it was said earlier, there's a reason nobody has a problem with Ryan being promoted either.

That's my final blow up here. There's no point in saying anything further from me since it's just gonna be misconstrued as harassment and be completely ignored as usual.

[J@CK XDDD]

This is all so very tiring I really hate the idea that its a friend group thing but foxka might be right in that. I really feel like this has became such big thing for no reason. I understand how both sides are thinking to some existent (obviously I'm not gonna assume entirely because that's not fair) I sent an apology out to them because this is just....so fucking stupid. Got to agree with foxka again though these 13 pages wont change anything but hey at least we got some aggression out and even had somewhat of a discussion. I hope Gabe approves of this post so you guys can enjoy this video bc we need to be sorry #freezeke

[chibill]

Okay, I am going to make my first post on this thread just to comment on my point of view.

As someone new the community (joined around March / April) I have no idea what issues any of you have with each other, and I haven't seen the community going down hit at all (as others have claimed). I have been here for 2 admins stepping down, and honestly even as staff I haven't noticed a bad change in the community. I have even seen its state improve to where we have had to do less as staff on TTT. (Mostly on the TTT end, when we introduced the new warn system people finally figured out to stop braking the rules.)

Like yes I would have liked to have some input into this, but doing some research nearly all of the web staff have been appointed with little to no community input, so honestly no problem to me.

I don't really understand why this is exploding into such a big deal. But then again like I said at the start, I am really new here and don't know much of anyones past, unless I go dig it up myself.