[Beskar Baron]

The wand does no direct damage, and is not listed as a map-specific reason to KOS. Therefore, it falls into a gray area in the rules, where despite being annoying, it isn't explicitly KOSable.

[Ckg]

The wand does no direct damage, and is not listed as a map-specific reason to KOS. Therefore, it falls into a gray area in the rules, where despite being annoying, it isn't explicitly KOSable.

Please read what I wrote before

HARM DOES NOT MEAN THE SAME THING AS DAMAGE


Carrying any map-specific item that can damage or harm players, whether they be a T trap or prop weapon.

The wand is a prop weapon that harms players by trapping them indefinitely over the course of a round.

Again please read this before responding, I tried to make it as simple as possible.

[matt_st3 (Strongrule)]

Oh lord its been so long that I don't remember what we decided. Nicol could probably search the staff discord for "wand" to see. Turns out change logs are important, huh.
As it is, it does no damage and is not defined as a traitor weapon so using it isn't kosable in of itself. The "puts them in harms way" argument immediately falls apart because the same goes for pushing someone into the community pool, giving someone ammo, a detective holding someone with a grapple...
These are all things that do not directly harm but received notes/rules because the results harm/cause death. The grapple got a warning rule along with several other issues because of this.
Also, several of you are misquoting the rule "Carrying any map-specific item that can damage or harm players, whether they be a T trap or prop weapon." If you would read it, the rule is based on the direct damage or harm as it is written. The wand puts them in a T trap but does not activate it. Some other rules overlap this, which is what you are really reaching for. "Activating map traps with the intent to kill someone" and "Knowingly contributing to the traitor objective on applicable objective maps." come into play here. If its defined as a trap, then "Activating map traps with the intent to kill someone" also comes into play. But the trap narrative still doesn't work as the rules require direct damage or death as a result. The traitor objective works assuming its a map objective, but that's never how we defined it. The trapping rules fall apart over the ample time given since you cant escape. So since this one instance evades the normally applied rules it needs to be a map specific rule. Since it does but you in an inescapable jail, one that has the possibility of a t coming by to kill you in, it really could be added easily.

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harm =/= hinder

[Ckg]

Either way it still needs to be more clear. If it isn’t clear to all staff members then problems can occur such as wrongful slays.

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Also would to add I have never seen anyone being killed for tping peole with the wand ever since I joined back. I could be wrong and someone has done that but I haven’t seen it happen when I’m on.

I was wrong, it is always KOS to carry it, in the same way as a knife is KOS.  If no one has been killed for tp'ing that is likely cuz they don't care or don't know the rules.

[JesseTheUndeadCowboy]

Oh lord its been so long that I don't remember what we decided. Nicol could probably search the staff discord for "wand" to see. Turns out change logs are important, huh.
As it is, it does no damage and is not defined as a traitor weapon so using it isn't kosable in of itself. The "puts them in harms way" argument immediately falls apart because the same goes for pushing someone into the community pool, giving someone ammo, a detective holding someone with a grapple...
These are all things that do not directly harm but received notes/rules because the results harm/cause death. The grapple got a warning rule along with several other issues because of this.
Also, several of you are misquoting the rule "Carrying any map-specific item that can damage or harm players, whether they be a T trap or prop weapon." If you would read it, the rule is based on the direct damage or harm as it is written. The wand puts them in a T trap but does not activate it. Some other rules overlap this, which is what you are really reaching for. "Activating map traps with the intent to kill someone" and "Knowingly contributing to the traitor objective on applicable objective maps." come into play here. If its defined as a trap, then "Activating map traps with the intent to kill someone" also comes into play. But the trap narrative still doesn't work as the rules require direct damage or death as a result. The traitor objective works assuming its a map objective, but that's never how we defined it. The trapping rules fall apart over the ample time given since you cant escape. So since this one instance evades the normally applied rules it needs to be a map specific rule. Since it does but you in an inescapable jail, one that has the possibility of a t coming by to kill you in, it really could be added easily.

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harm =/= hinder

So wait as it stands is it not kosable to use the wanda on other players then or is it?

[Nicol Bolas]

The rule mentioned above is meant for all types of holdable map weapons and barrels. This includes the wand on dimmsdale. I'm not making a list of every single example it is common sense. It has and always will be KOSable to bring the wand near players. Pointless argument is pointless

[JesseTheUndeadCowboy]

The rule mentioned above is meant for all types of holdable map weapons and barrels. This includes the wand on dimmsdale. I'm not making a list of every single example it is common sense. It has and always will be KOSable to bring the wand near players. Pointless argument is pointless

Alright I understand now. I was honestly confused on the whole thing. Sorry Nicol.

[Nicol Bolas]

If it wasn't a clear rule revision that that was likely my fault. If needed I can amend it

[Ckg]

Oh lord its been so long that I don't remember what we decided. Nicol could probably search the staff discord for "wand" to see. Turns out change logs are important, huh.
As it is, it does no damage and is not defined as a traitor weapon so using it isn't kosable in of itself. The "puts them in harms way" argument immediately falls apart because the same goes for pushing someone into the community pool, giving someone ammo, a detective holding someone with a grapple...
These are all things that do not directly harm but received notes/rules because the results harm/cause death. The grapple got a warning rule along with several other issues because of this.
Also, several of you are misquoting the rule "Carrying any map-specific item that can damage or harm players, whether they be a T trap or prop weapon." If you would read it, the rule is based on the direct damage or harm as it is written. The wand puts them in a T trap but does not activate it. Some other rules overlap this, which is what you are really reaching for. "Activating map traps with the intent to kill someone" and "Knowingly contributing to the traitor objective on applicable objective maps." come into play here. If its defined as a trap, then "Activating map traps with the intent to kill someone" also comes into play. But the trap narrative still doesn't work as the rules require direct damage or death as a result. The traitor objective works assuming its a map objective, but that's never how we defined it. The trapping rules fall apart over the ample time given since you cant escape. So since this one instance evades the normally applied rules it needs to be a map specific rule. Since it does but you in an inescapable jail, one that has the possibility of a t coming by to kill you in, it really could be added easily.

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harm =/= hinder

I have to disagree with this because Door Blocking is a reason to KOS.  It hinders a player's ability to play the game, much like door blocking.  Also I'd like to point out that trapping is not the same a using a t trap.  Trapping in this sense is the literal meaning of preventing (someone) from escaping from a place. The wand itself is not a trap, but it is a prop weapon.  Also each reason to KOS is separate from the other ones.  To be a map-specific T trap or prop weapon it doesn't need to tick the boxes on the activating map traps or traitor objective rules.  It is its own standalone rule that functions as a reason independantly from the others.

[Beskar Baron]

THEN PUT IT IN THE RULE BOOK!
NONE OF THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN AN ISSUE IF RESPONSE THE PREVIOUSLY DISCUSSED GRAY AREA IN THE RULES WAS ADDRESSED IN THE RULES!
THAT IS A SIMPLE SOLUTION!

Edit: sorry, missed a few posts. However, ALL special cases should be directly addressed in the rules.