[chelllman]

I understand where you're coming from but this is a word that has no racial or cultural significant. I mean, if it's an issue of someone calling you a retard all the time or blatantly mocking someone who's retarded then I'd get it but outright banning the word is too far

I disagree with your assertion that the word has no cultural significance.  The disabled absolutely have their own culture.  I've attended a few regional special Olympics to cheer on some I know, and it's honestly something I really recommend people experience.

Words we consider to be slurs tend to be words that historically were and still are used to dehumanize others deemed to be "sub-human".  One thing that's really lacking in US education is the sheer amount of blood-curdling, brutal, and ruthless systematic experimentation and exploitation of the intellectually disabled in the US in the 20th century.  Things like forced medical treatments, drug testing, castration, etc.   It's often not taught simply because the severely mentally disabled individuals couldn't advocate for their rights, so it's often overlooked.  If you don't believe me, I can privately message you links to articles and video archives cataloging these abuses since I don't want to expose anyone to it who doesn't want to even see the URL links.

The word "retard" absolutely is still used to demean and dehumanize.  Kantar TNS (studies done by them are pretty scientifically sound) found that in their sample of 50 million social media posts about the intellectually disabled, roughly 70% were negative and roughly 60% used some variation of "retard". https://www.specialolympics.org/stories/...the-r-slur


When I'm staffing, I understand that some people were raised differently so I make a compromise.  I treat it in the same fashion that PH has to treat the N-word ending in -a.  You can say it, but as soon as you use it in a derogatory way towards another player then I take action and follow the slur protocol.  Note to admins: I make sure to list which slurs players use for this very reason.

[dong]

I coached the Special Olympics in high school, so I can definitely feel where you’re coming from to some level. In terms of this being the internet though, I do not see a scenario in which TTT will ban the word. If anything we’ll just punish people for being assholes to each other like we always have.

[Raider Hanks]

No thanks man. I respect both sides and their opinions over the term, but I cannot support adding it into our "slur" category for punishment within TTT. My view towards it is the same as it always has been. If it is used to legitimately harass an individual, the case is subject to our harassment guidelines. If it is banter between gamers or friends, I could not care less. If that gamer banter explodes out of hand into full blown arguments between players, we have the guidelines for it. If someone feels the necessity to spam the term just to annoy people, its harassment or spam.

Fundamentally, I can never support the banning of language. On that same note though, I also will NOT take action against our present policy towards slurs and derogatory terms. Such rules are necessary to prevent individuals from being harassed. This is a community where we want to be inclusive and have fun, in order to bring people together to play video games. Both. Not one or the other.

[murl]

Now for my less serious reply. I asked my mentally challenged friend to read this to give their opinion and their exact words were "that's retarded". Which is funny. I agree with hong.

please keep our private conversations off the forum!


but yeah it shouldn't be punishable unless it's used in bad faith to harass someone like Bryan said, similarly to how ASD-related insults are handled

[Salty]

No thanks man. I respect both sides and their opinions over the term, but I cannot support adding it into our "slur" category for punishment within TTT. 
Fundamentally, I can never support the banning of language. On that same note though, I also will NOT take action against our present policy towards slurs and derogatory terms. Such rules are necessary to prevent individuals from being harassed. This is a community where we want to be inclusive and have fun, in order to bring people together to play video games. Both. Not one or the other.

Raider, could you elaborate why you do not support the "banning of language?" I find that to be a rather interesting quote and would like a little bit more clarification on it. In a context of banning books/works of art, I totally agree with that; however, the context of things that are considered to be slurs is a different scenario entirely. Yes you can use the "hate speech is free speech" argument but you also have to understand there are consequences when those kinds of words are said. Your last statement is a contradiction to me but I see that you and I fundamentally disagree on whether "retard" is a slur or not and that's what makes me think it's a contradiction where you argue that it is a fair point. I respect you too much to try and argue with you over this, but I still felt the need to say something. 

In terms of this being the internet though, I do not see a scenario in which TTT will ban the word. If anything we’ll just punish people for being assholes to each other like we always have.

 I can see something like this happening in prop hunt but not in TTT. 

I just would like to clarify something quickly: this is not something that I was limiting to just TTT, hence why I put the thread in Community/Site Suggestions rather than on the TTT equivalent tab. Now realistically, it doesn't really make any difference on the impact this thread will have, as I feel it would have be a unanimous agreement amongst the community staff in order to get this kind of regulation passed in my opinion. I just am saying this because I've seen a lot of feedback from TTT community members, but if any other community staff members would like to give their input, I would like to hear that as well. 

[⋆ Fx ⋆]

I don't think banning the word is the right way to go. I say it should be punishable to use the word in a derogatory manner like calling someone retarded over in over (harassment) or actually using it towards someone with a known learning disability. But casually like saying "I'm retarded" or calling someone a retard for doing something dumb i don't think should be punishable.

[BlackRose1042]

I completely agree and don't think it's sensitive to request this. People throw this word around too much, as well as several others. It's not that hard to be considerate and watch what you say. My honest opinion is that there should be stricter rules and heavier punishments for bullying, bigotry and slurs, especially in a community that focuses on being inclusive.
But I'm glad the staff here do a good job and try their best to keep things chill

[matt_st3 (Strongrule)]

I’ve seen a growing number of responses to issues like this were a rule already covers the scenario that suggest an inconsistency in rules vs staffing in reality. Exploits come to mind, anywhere there’s a comment to the tune of “why don’t we enforce the rules we already have”. Surely if this is an actual issue in server of harassment / people being general assholes staff can use existing harassment rules to gag/mute whatever when necessary? I know it’s done “casually” in the community but if it’s in an insulting or similar manner then it would be no stretch enforce an existing rule.

[reinaberg]

I think this is a thread that should be made by someone who is actually affected by the use of the word and not someone who is trying to speak over those people to express his own offense on their behalf. This thread wasn't made for the benefit of others, it's just virtue signaling.

(+as a retard, I think this shouldn't become a rule)

[Salty]

I think this is a thread that should be made by someone who is actually affected by the use of the word and not someone who is trying to speak over those people to express his own offense on their behalf. This thread wasn't made for the benefit of others, it's just virtue signaling.

(+as a retard, I think this shouldn't become a rule)

In 2002, I was diagnosed with Severe Autism Spectrum Disorder by the University of Vanderbilt. I had developed it at 23 months, which is during the developmental stage of the brain. My parents had me go through Applied Behavior Analysis after the doctors had told my parents that I would be unable to do anything on my own. I did not say a word until I was 4, and I had a speech impediment until I was 8. After doing ABA for years, I was told by Dr. Mary L. Michael (my Child Development Doctor) in 2012 that I had no traces of autism left. I cannot tell you of anything that happened before I was 5. For example, I had a moment the other day: when I heard Dancing Queen by ABBA on the Heardle, knew how the song's melody went, but I couldn't recall ever listening to it; turns out that was what my OT (occupational therapist) would have to play in order to make me do anything when I was 3.


For you to say that I'm not actually affected by use of the word invalidates the rigorous amount of harassment my brother, family and I all faced because of the fact he was diagnosed with ASD and the time that I had it, and to be completely honest, that infuriates me; however, I can understand why you might've thought that I was virtue signaling because I never explicitly told you any of this in private conversation, just that my brother did after that one discussion we had about whether or not ASD is categorized as a learning disability (In TN, it is up until 4th grade but it isn't recognized as a learning disability federally but rather only as a neurological disorder, as you and I both know). 


And before anyone tries telling me that you "cannot grow out of autism," you most certainly can. There is an established statement that autism is a permanent diagnosis; however, the article I have attached challenges this viewpoint by showing that children diagnosed with ASD that had lost it had the same developments as the typical children they used as a control group in the study. I would also say that I also am an example of that as well. My brother for the most part is also functional now; his problems stem more with behavioral and emotional control than intellect.

Here's the article: click here

I did not want to share this initially because that's obviously extremely personal, but I need you and anyone else to understand that I am not someone who is simply virtue signaling.

Ultimately, I know the word isn't going to be banned. People will still use it, and I probably will have a couple jokes thrown my way about this. That's fine; as I said numerous times, I will not be someone who screams at others for using the word. Perhaps I should have worded/suggested this thread differently; rather than to ban the word entirely, it probably would've been slightly more useful as a thread if I had said that I did not want to the word said around me. 


I say leave this open for maybe 2 more days, and if nobody says anything else, somebody can just lock it. I really don't have anything else I can say about this thread anymore; I explained why it's got cultural/racial significance and now I just unloaded my personal experience with the word because I cannot stand virtue signaling so I would rather take the opportunity to explain why I'm not doing that said thing than sit idly by. 


Once again, for those of you who gave meaningful and respectful input on this thread, I appreciate you. I may have not gotten the outcome I was hoping for but I feel better being able to express my thoughts on this. Thank you all for your time.