[Foxka]

Burrito you and I both know this ban was horse shit. You shouldn't have done it if a plain noob already handled it. What the fuck were you thinking? And yes you do hold grudges, I see it happen all the time with you.

[Sugam]

Bump? Anyone gonna make a final decision on this?

My prediction is they will keep you banned because

*Pulls some excuse out of the BS excuse pile*

Because you were banned for an incident 11 months ago

you were karma banned on
http://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/tttbans/d...1485373449
25-01-17 14:44
And even though nobody has any details on why you were karma banned this day if it was because of real rdms  or if it was due to some legitimate circumstances such as people tbaiting you    it will probably be held against you for the rest of your miserable life...

Because:


In reality over 90% of our karma bans are immediately unbanned  In Fact   By admins  if they are available and around to unban.  Meaning a lot of karma bans, most are false positives (of mass rdmers).
Proof
https://ibb.co/jH6tsb

(also for the record one person on the server was karma banned 6 separate times and was unbanned by an admin each time and there has been only 1 instance were someone was karma banned which almost came close to that record at 3 times)


*Pulls some new excuse out of the BS excuse pile*

Also you were banned for 2 whole days the next day 26-01-17 17:11 because of that incident on that one map where you said its ok to kos someone for abusing / spamming an annoying sound generating feature within a map mousehouse.   

And that was "rule making uping" and you did MURDER DEATH KILL those people who spammed the fuck out of that annoying sound thingy in your attempt to help make the server tolerable to play on,  you know   with them sound spamming,  they, making the game unplayable, and intolerable...
Something that if they did on a mic they would be gaged and kicked and possibly even banned for in extreme circumstances. 
DARN YOU maker rule upper! You got REKT by that 2 day ban. They were WAY too lenient. Those FOOLS!
http://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/tttbans/d...1485468680

Even though it was 11 months ago since your name has been brought up for any issues your still dirty trash for it and you have not learned a god damn thing!
Try weaseling your way out of this one  like you apparently weasel yourself out of SOOOOOOO many things...   2... that you weaseled out of....  you   you WEASEL!

[Lovanatana]

+1 for reduction. This is too situational, complex, and unfair.

The entire reason Dinkleberg made changes for the rules regarding RDM and leave and ghosting (yes, slightly irrelevant, hold on) were to keep our older community from being banned long periods by frivelous, tip-of-the-iceberg issues.

This is one of those issues. Mistakes happen. Let's work the way Dink would want us to.

[Starky]

Bump? Anyone gonna make a final decision on this?

My prediction is they will keep you banned because

*Pulls some excuse out of the BS excuse pile*

Because you were banned for an incident 11 months ago

you were karma banned on
http://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/tttbans/d...1485373449
25-01-17 14:44
And even though nobody has any details on why you were karma banned this day if it was because of real rdms  or if it was due to some legitimate circumstances such as people tbaiting you    it will probably be held against you for the rest of your miserable life. 

*Pulls some new excuse out of the BS excuse pile*

Also you were banned for 2 whole days the next day 26-01-17 17:11 because of that incident on that one map where you said its ok to kos someone for abusing / spamming an annoying sound generating feature within a map mousehouse.   

And that was "rule making uping" and you did rdm those people who spammed the fuck out of that annoying sound thingy in your attempt to help make the server tolerable to play on,  you know   with them sound spamming,  
Something that if they did on a mic they would be gaged and kicked and possibly even banned for in extreme circumstances.  You maker rule upper!
http://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/tttbans/d...1485468680

Even though it was 11 months ago since your name has been brought up for any issues your still dirty trash for it and you have not learned a god damn thing!
Try weaseling your way out of this one  like you apparently weasel yourself out of SOOOOOOO many things...   2... that you weaseled out of....  you   you WEASEL!

You sir, made my night. I appreciate this post.

[queef commando]

Immature ad absurdum argument that doesn't try to understand what anyone else is saying, and makes it seem like thinking anything else is stupid

Or maybe the point is that repeated offences should not be met with clemency every time. If you are given a ban, but do the same thing again it's reasonable for the staff to then say "huh, he has not grown or learned from past mistakes so maybe being lenient for the umpteenth time isn't the correct choice." If you look at the rules, repeated offences escalate the punishment. One offence is usually a slay, repeated offences are usually a ban because it shows no attempt to improve, and no attempt to understand what went wrong. Setro you have been banned four times that I can recall, and demoted thrice. And still you do the same types of things. I have not supported long bans against you in the past because I think that you can change. Messing around is fine, but including people that aren't in on the joke isn't. But time and again even years later I see you doing the same things. I think you need some punishment so I don't support an immediate unban here. But I also don't think this is the thing that should get you perma'd either.

[Sugam]

At what point do people stop bringing up the past?   is it 1 year?   2 years?   Is he just shy of that 1 year mark?

Because I've been banned from this server for mass rdm 2 times and never served more than 5 days.
First time was what   17 people?   second time was 4 or 5?   help remind me juujuu  how many people did i rdm?

No one brought that up when they gave me mod or allowed me to work on the server.
Noone gave a fuck then for sure when someone stepped forward to fix shit up.

So there must be some kind of arbitrary cutoff point where people magically forget past shit people have done.
Lets work together to find this mythical timeframe.

But right now you are arguing like he does this on a monthly basis.   Its been almost a year since his arguably questionable ban (considering his actions were an attempt to help and aid the server).
 
Besides year to me don't seem like a constant repeated offence to me.

I would like to know the 4 times he was banned for rdming was.  Surely we got some record on one of the forums right?
But like i said can you even count the karma ban?   Do you even know the details of it?

Do you have any details of any bans other then the one ban you laid down.
I'm not sure if you do.  You were so out of touch you thought you banned him 6 months ago.   About 5 months short.

Lets whip it out.  Show me the money.  
Banned 4 times   what are the details.

[queef commando]

The past stops getting brought up when it stops being relevant. You've been banned but I'm gonna venture a guess that you improved your behavior or showed that the ban was mistaken in some way. It stopped being relevant because it stopped being characteristic of you. The only reason setro doing something silly hasn't been happening regularly since the last ban is because he stopped playing (did you know that or are you "so out of touch"). Now he starts playing again and has a major incident in less than a week of rejoining. The issue isn't how long ago something happened but how often it happens whenever the opportunity is available.

As for the previous bans you're right I can't remember the details exactly. I'm not that invested in them, and I have nothing against setro personally that I would be thinking about them still. But I know what I've experienced. I know he was banned once for ghosting other than the nicky incident, and I know I've spoken to him about similar incidents in the past, and I know that I personally banned him for making up rules and wrongfully enforcing them after being told not to by multiple staff. I know this isn't the first time I've seen him make bad call decisions while trying to have fun, but inadvertently ruining the fun of other people in the process. I understand that it isn't malicious which is why I can't support a permaban or even a particularly long ban, but I also know that it can't keep happening as if the past doesn't matter at all. And you can tell me that I have something against setro, but I don't. I'm allowed to form opinions on people based on interaction and what happens ingame without posting a report to the forums every time it happens.

I also don't understand the point of trying to turn this into a fight or dick measuring contest (as per "Let's whip it out") instead of just having a discussion about the right course of action.

[Sugam]

Oh i found my old bans

and only 2 months apart. You must think I'm garbage in comparison. I just did it over and over.

http://dinklebergsttt.enjin.com/forum/m/...ban-appeal
http://dinklebergsttt.enjin.com/forum/m/...ban-appeal

So i pull 2 stunts 2 months apart. Gets rewarded with Moderator and Works on the server.

Setro and his 11 months from his last ban and people keep condemning him?

I'm proud if anything that he has improved. He sure improved faster than i did.

[queef commando]

One, those links dont go to anything. (now they do)
Two, again being personal for some reason?
Three, 2 months of playtime apart vs less than 1 week of playtime apart.
Four, if you just ignore everything I say this isn't much of a discussion.

To recap I'm saying that a repeat offender staff member who attempted rdm should get maybe a monthish ban which is about the precedent, so I don't think it's unreasonable.

[Sugam]

Touche!

I fixed my links :P

But
Dont take it personally but i do enjoy a good argument from time to time.

Its 4 am lets end this and go to bed like gentlemen.

---

But i will say this

if this whole thing started with the line you ended on
" I'm allowed to form opinions on people based on interaction and what happens ingame without posting a report to the forums every time it happens."

instead of the constant talk about his bans among people like i have been listening to in the staff channel
I would have never have taken this argument as far as i did. Thats why i only talked about his bans. because to me his past bans are nothing. 1 account of ghosting from ages back, an undocumented karma ban that noone knows anything about, a ban for a misguided decision to try to HELP the server using bad methods and now this incen incident. I dont see any patterns there. I just see some completely unrelated incidents.

Nothing was ever said about additional undocumented behavior issues.

You acknowledge you have undocumented information about his behavior on the server. Something that was never brought up before until that paragraph. And i respect that.

Now we get to the heart of the matter.