[Avi]

I know I have been talking about this for a bit now, but I would like to address the Discord Moderator section of the initial thread post.  Please take a look at this recent thread I posted, and I hope with what was added that it addresses some of the concerns on both your end and those that hold the rank.
https://www.dinklebergsgmod.com/site/Thr...ord-Update

[Darkkran]

Okay, so I've had a discussion with a member of the community, and how they see things being handled from the players/staffs side of things. I would say this surprises me but as a player myself it doesn't because I know fellow players. I'm here to explain to you how exactly the perspective of Dink looks on the player/staff. I cannot say that I am one hundred percent certain about this perspective, but I'm going to attempt to try to explain some of the things that Dink is most likely going through.


Trust is earned not given..
As an owner of a semi populated server, (No I will not give you a name, and no it isn't ABOUT me.), there are tasks I face every single day. I would like to share some of the hardships that I face and I'm sure could be cross examined here. I currently have around 13 staff members under my name, and I'm responsible for how each and everyone of them act, and it's tiring trying to control how they think or act at all times. I've learned slowly over the week that if I let them be who they are with strict guidelines that they all handle things differently, but knowing I expect the same results in the end. Now there are moments, when I have to take my eyes off staff and handle my business in real life or want to decompress from working, and I have to put trust into my staff team to have the integrity to handle things the correct way and conduct themselves the correct way when I am not around. This is a "big fear factor" over the internet, trust is something you rarely find when you are dealing with a position of power. When it comes to giving access to certain things, it cannot be all at once. I will never hand someone full control over something I don't want them to have until I trust them, or I pay them with an "agreement". With this said, the level of trust that I would assume Dink has with some of you is like a very good friend, but the level of trust I'm talking about is legit "blood" family. When there is WITHOUT a doubt that someone would do something harmful to the server or the community itself.

Player/Staff Interactions in (ALL ASPECTS)
I come face to face with players in game all the time, and it normally goes a few ways. They will either play the game correctly and we will all enjoy those moments together creating a bond with those players. Having them stay is wonderful and honestly all its about is making sure everyone is having fun. Then I have players that will go directly up to me, and suggest things for the server when I'm currently doing something that would be "in character" and I don't mind it, but there is a place and time for it. There is a place on this forums for it, and a place for it in my discord to suggest any and EVERYTHING. Then I have players that come up to me asking me about staff applications, or role permissions or even blacklist permissions. It becomes tiresome and honestly it puts a damper on me trying to decompress and enjoy the server I have spent so much time, money, and my personal energy in. I have found myself hovering over the Icon for the game I run the server on, really really asking myself if I wanna deal with that today. Constantly being harassed by players for things that could be handled on our discord (or on the discord/forums in this case) just isn't what I pictured when I made a server to let everyone enjoy.

Depression, yes actual emotions..
When it comes to the place that I have spent time into creating and really working hard and looking at a final product piece I put out, it's honestly amazing and I love looking at the work I've done. I post the update, and BAM. I'm hit with "well why didn't you do this" or "why didn't you add that". It just slams your emotions into the ground when you see someone trash your work, or even trash the conversation about changing the server because it isn't the view they see for the server. When in reality, it isn't their server but it still hits close to that part of "Why am I really doing this?" You may say that ups and downs are a normal part of life, but opening my discord and going to my main area of my suggestions channel and seeing people constantly bash and put down my work, it hurts alot. I recently had a staff member bash my work, after I spent about 3-4 hours learning how to do something and finally finished it, I was super happy about it. Rolled it out, and the first thing from their mouth was "Why is this blacklisted, that's fucking stupid." it honestly feels like always fighting uphill from those around me. I've gone to my Co-Owner a few times and had to grab a pick me up, because of certain things. I've been blessed to have a wonderful Co-Owner that always supports everything we do as a server. He calls me out on things, and explains to me in great detail how he feels about certain things instead of saying "Well you said that last time you forgot."

Work/School/IRL...
I do know some of you understand that life is hard, and it can be taxing for every the most organized person on the earth, but we are not perfect and we forget things. From what I know Dink is currently doing IRL stuff that takes a MAJORITY of his time. This can be pushed into the word of "forgetfulness" because he isn't a super computer that can set an alarm in his head to do certain things. When he comes home from IRL, and sits down at his computer, I'm sure this is what he sees from day to day. You have a few messages from Staff, requesting role changes/Discord changes/ changes in general. Players that somehow figured out a way to bypass the "direct message" option in discord. Steam messages, Forum Pings, and more.

Your Role Hurts...
Now take a moment, really think about this. Do you think he can remember EVERY single interaction with each person from day to day, if he only has 5-10 minutes to spare, and might want to listen to his favorite song? Or maybe he wants to play a 30 minutes of his favorite game, and has been stressing over work/school ALL day long? When he finally gets a few hours to work on the server, he has to sit down and think. "Damn, what did Nuru say she needed a few days ago?", "Fuck steam crashed and deleted the messages, but I know I can fix this thing over here right quick". That is how his job works, he fixes what he can in the time that he can, and everything is taken into account that "Oh fuck, I forgot I have a test at work/school I need to study for, gotta cut this quick." The person you are ranting about knows the struggle you guys are facing, but why put any amount of work into fixing something if someones is always bitching. Not to mention the people that he should be able to trust the most to push him higher to help him and his server succeed?

Dink is Human. He has limited time. He is forgetful. He is sad. He is happy. He is everything we are, with more people looking at him.

I am defending Dink in this, and I do think he could do things to improve and fix the server. But from a standpoint from someone that handles a small portion of his hardships. I understand why he is so emotionally drained to come in here and speak with any of you. Time is valuable, and his is normally taken... If you want to complain about something, at least have a ways to fix what you are suggesting. When I say "ways to fix", you need to have a presentation for him, that he can ponder over with the limited time he has. He isn't the guy rolling around in the money and laughing, he's the guy trying to better himself while running a community. You want him to do a role change, make an excel sheet/google document of things that need to be done and EXPLAIN why they should or need to be done.

Your actions affect his emotions, which in return affect his reactions. You guys have shot him down every time he goes to speak, so why do anything but save his breath?

Before you reply to this, think about how you could have directly effected this situation. Know your place in this discussion, and really really think about him in general...

[Nicol Bolas]

Okay, so I've had a discussion with a member of the community, and how they see things being handled from the players/staffs side of things. I would say this surprises me but as a player myself it doesn't because I know fellow players. I'm here to explain to you how exactly the perspective of Dink looks on the player/staff. I cannot say that I am one hundred percent certain about this perspective, but I'm going to attempt to try to explain some of the things that Dink is most likely going through.


Trust is earned not given..
As an owner of a semi populated server, (No I will not give you a name, and no it isn't ABOUT me.), there are tasks I face every single day. I would like to share some of the hardships that I face and I'm sure could be cross examined here. I currently have around 13 staff members under my name, and I'm responsible for how each and everyone of them act, and it's tiring trying to control how they think or act at all times. I've learned slowly over the week that if I let them be who they are with strict guidelines that they all handle things differently, but knowing I expect the same results in the end. Now there are moments, when I have to take my eyes off staff and handle my business in real life or want to decompress from working, and I have to put trust into my staff team to have the integrity to handle things the correct way and conduct themselves the correct way when I am not around. This is a "big fear factor" over the internet, trust is something you rarely find when you are dealing with a position of power. When it comes to giving access to certain things, it cannot be all at once. I will never hand someone full control over something I don't want them to have until I trust them, or I pay them with an "agreement". With this said, the level of trust that I would assume Dink has with some of you is like a very good friend, but the level of trust I'm talking about is legit "blood" family. When there is WITHOUT a doubt that someone would do something harmful to the server or the community itself.

Player/Staff Interactions in (ALL ASPECTS)
I come face to face with players in game all the time, and it normally goes a few ways. They will either play the game correctly and we will all enjoy those moments together creating a bond with those players. Having them stay is wonderful and honestly all its about is making sure everyone is having fun. Then I have players that will go directly up to me, and suggest things for the server when I'm currently doing something that would be "in character" and I don't mind it, but there is a place and time for it. There is a place on this forums for it, and a place for it in my discord to suggest any and EVERYTHING. Then I have players that come up to me asking me about staff applications, or role permissions or even blacklist permissions. It becomes tiresome and honestly it puts a damper on me trying to decompress and enjoy the server I have spent so much time, money, and my personal energy in. I have found myself hovering over the Icon for the game I run the server on, really really asking myself if I wanna deal with that today. Constantly being harassed by players for things that could be handled on our discord (or on the discord/forums in this case) just isn't what I pictured when I made a server to let everyone enjoy.

Depression, yes actual emotions..
When it comes to the place that I have spent time into creating and really working hard and looking at a final product piece I put out, it's honestly amazing and I love looking at the work I've done. I post the update, and BAM. I'm hit with "well why didn't you do this" or "why didn't you add that". It just slams your emotions into the ground when you see someone trash your work, or even trash the conversation about changing the server because it isn't the view they see for the server. When in reality, it isn't their server but it still hits close to that part of "Why am I really doing this?" You may say that ups and downs are a normal part of life, but opening my discord and going to my main area of my suggestions channel and seeing people constantly bash and put down my work, it hurts alot. I recently had a staff member bash my work, after I spent about 3-4 hours learning how to do something and finally finished it, I was super happy about it. Rolled it out, and the first thing from their mouth was "Why is this blacklisted, that's fucking stupid." it honestly feels like always fighting uphill from those around me. I've gone to my Co-Owner a few times and had to grab a pick me up, because of certain things. I've been blessed to have a wonderful Co-Owner that always supports everything we do as a server. He calls me out on things, and explains to me in great detail how he feels about certain things instead of saying "Well you said that last time you forgot."

Work/School/IRL...
I do know some of you understand that life is hard, and it can be taxing for every the most organized person on the earth, but we are not perfect and we forget things. From what I know Dink is currently doing IRL stuff that takes a MAJORITY of his time. This can be pushed into the word of "forgetfulness" because he isn't a super computer that can set an alarm in his head to do certain things. When he comes home from IRL, and sits down at his computer, I'm sure this is what he sees from day to day. You have a few messages from Staff, requesting role changes/Discord changes/ changes in general. Players that somehow figured out a way to bypass the "direct message" option in discord. Steam messages, Forum Pings, and more.

Your Role Hurts...
Now take a moment, really think about this. Do you think he can remember EVERY single interaction with each person from day to day, if he only has 5-10 minutes to spare, and might want to listen to his favorite song? Or maybe he wants to play a 30 minutes of his favorite game, and has been stressing over work/school ALL day long? When he finally gets a few hours to work on the server, he has to sit down and think. "Damn, what did Nuru say she needed a few days ago?", "Fuck steam crashed and deleted the messages, but I know I can fix this thing over here right quick". That is how his job works, he fixes what he can in the time that he can, and everything is taken into account that "Oh fuck, I forgot I have a test at work/school I need to study for, gotta cut this quick." The person you are ranting about knows the struggle you guys are facing, but why put any amount of work into fixing something if someones is always bitching. Not to mention the people that he should be able to trust the most to push him higher to help him and his server succeed?

Dink is Human. He has limited time. He is forgetful. He is sad. He is happy. He is everything we are, with more people looking at him.

I am defending Dink in this, and I do think he could do things to improve and fix the server. But from a standpoint from someone that handles a small portion of his hardships. I understand why he is so emotionally drained to come in here and speak with any of you. Time is valuable, and his is normally taken... If you want to complain about something, at least have a ways to fix what you are suggesting. When I say "ways to fix", you need to have a presentation for him, that he can ponder over with the limited time he has. He isn't the guy rolling around in the money and laughing, he's the guy trying to better himself while running a community. You want him to do a role change, make an excel sheet/google document of things that need to be done and EXPLAIN why they should or need to be done.

Your actions affect his emotions, which in return affect his reactions. You guys have shot him down every time he goes to speak, so why do anything but save his breath?

Before you reply to this, think about how you could have directly effected this situation. Know your place in this discussion, and really really think about him in general...

This is a really useful perspective, and I'm very glad you shared it. Many are too quick to demonize and vilify the very person who brought this community together. Personally I understand why people are upset, but people tend to only view their side. The lack of direct communication is still an issue, but I do understand why it hasn't happened often. I've not been here for very long compared to many of this community, and I do hope some of the underlying issues are addressed and hopefully fixed because I do love this community.

[Mother Nuru.]

Ok who should be co-owner then since the admins are virtually being called incompetent of being a leader by the same people who always complain

People here have suggested people, but the only one who can make that decision is Dink himself. This thread isn't meant to shit on anyone. It's a call to Dink that things need to be changed. The admins aren't incompetent and are doing everything they can do. People who are complaining about the admins really should be complain about the lack of central leadership. The admins can only do so much when their leader is absent 90% of the time. If you actually read the thread instead of just shitting on people for wanting simple change, then you'd know this. This is the last of the argument I will be in to avoid filling the thread with useless arguments. I encourage you to do the same.

I'm not trying to be mean, but nobody has "suggested people" everyone keeps throwing gabe up.
Who is inactive by server hours time.
And that only fixes TTT. What about PH?
Neither fish nor myself feel confident to take on a position like that but we need one. So whats the solution there?
Burrito has a point here, while maybe not stated in the best way, he has a point. Everyone complains that we as admins cannot do our jobs, but you guys do scream for a co-owner. That would come from the pool of admins that everyone lately has been bad mouthing.

This is a really useful perspective, and I'm very glad you shared it. Many are too quick to demonize and vilify the very person who brought this community together. Personally I understand why people are upset, but people tend to only view their side. The lack of direct communication is still an issue, but I do understand why it hasn't happened often. I've not been here for very long compared to many of this community, and I do hope some of the underlying issues are addressed and hopefully fixed because I do love this community.

This is something i got into an arguement with the admins over last night. Yes its okay to be frustrated. Yes things need to change. But they don't consider the other sides. Just their side and where it benefits them. We can't get anywhere liek that, all we're doing is driving him to stay away longer and for good. But things get twisted up. That's fine.
Communication is so SOO very important.
Dink is graduating this year and spending the majority of his time towards that. That is where most of his time goes right now. To make sure he graduates. Then he works. among his social life with friends/gf/etc.
It would be super if he could dedicate a day to here every week, but I'm not going to EXPECT that, because I can't even do that myself.
That's something I keep repeating myself on. I refuse to hold Dinkleberg to expectations that I cannot fufill myself.
I refuse. And his position is so much harder than mine. I can hardly keep it sane here where I am from the way the community treats us.